Fun thread on eurofoolery

Cool Polish blogger Michael lost his patience with a Belgian friend of his Patrick who kept spreading the typical European Anti American spiel in his technical blog entries . So he wrote him a public message Provoked telling him to lay off. I have no idea of what Michael’s politics are but it was refreshing to see:

Philip, I hate to be the one to tell you that, but you really shouldn’t lecture people if they should be ashamed of their country or not. Firstly, it’s bad style. Secondly, you have no moral right to do so. Thirdly – it makes you look silly.

The comments have become a fun collection of the usual suspects arguing it out with Michael and me taking the other side. Philip said:

Do I hide? I don’t. I express my opinion. Openly and indeed, in your face. Over and over again. That’s because I’m a caring individual. People in my personal life often tell me I care too much about things.

Hilarious. Philip is the lone crusader for world peace. Michael took him up on it:

Being anti-bush (or, unfortunately, anti-american) is a part of pop culture in europe. It’s a slogan. It’s easy. I doesn’t bring anything new. It won’t get you into any trouble – because your boss, your girlfriend, your cat and your dog are anti-bush already. It’s a safe way to say something “important” without getting any side effects.

There in lies the problem. My first comment is not particularly adult, but it is directed at this culture of backslapping fools, who never question each other. Yes you should read books, but just because it’s in print doesn’t make it the truth. If you believe in Chomsky I’ve got this great book Dianetic’s I’d like to sell you. Michale continues with much eloquence:

There are many problems we’ve got in europe, and you know that. You don’t need to read Chomsky’s books to understand them, you just need to look around. Discussing those problems is a bit more difficult, as it might make you unpopular. But don’t escape those problems by pointing your finger at someone else’s messy kitchen.

Again this is the core issue in Europe. Europe is falling apart by it’s seams and there is no serious debate here on how to fix it, because by some strange fate the same people who lead us into the quick sand are quick to point out that it was all the US fault. And don’t give me that crap that people are Anti-Bush not Anti-American. In the US you can say that, but the Anti-Bush crowd in Europe are I’m sorry to say blindly Anti-American. No matter what they say. If you say as I hear almost daily:

I hate Bush, not American citizens. I just wish I could make them understand through education that they have voted wrong.

You are saying I hate you you idiotic dimwitted American, why can’t you be more like us intelligent superior Europeans. I’m sorry but that is offensive and stupid.

Before going showing us his real jackboots Dutch guy Ralph makes this heart felt plea:

I personally live in the Netherlands. We’re such a small country on the internal scale: our foreign policy means jackshit. I get to vote, but unlike Americans, I can’t vote for world-peace.

News flash to Ralph. It was Al-Qaeda, Iran, Arafat and Hizbollah who started this war. Not the US. Unfortunately the only American vote that would create world-peace would be the one voting to convert the US into a caliphate. Whether you agree or not with how the US is waging the war doesn’t change that simple fact. Then Ralph starts on his Zionist conspiracy theories:

In our media, it is often explained and studied why this is happening in the US. Typical things that get mentioned are the fact that all national news channels are now owned by the same republican Zionist Rupert Murdoch. His channels also played a great role in getting away with the election fraud. It is also considered to be part of bigger change: the same thing is going on in Russia.

Again the myth that we Europeans are intellectually superior only this time he manages to go Nazi on us. Them pesky jews get everywhere.

My own comment to Ralph are below:

Ralph, thanks for at least having the pretence of wanting to debate. You are one of the few of this group who might actually be able of rational discourse. Although your idea that Murdoch is Zionist immediately raises warning flags. You being from the country of Anne Frank should immediately be disturbed of this kind of thing yourself.

I am libertarian. I am against government. I am all for the people having control over their own lives. Government serves one function for me and that is protection of life and property. Unfortunately while I would really like to say get out of the US.

You say that you can’t vote for world peace, but that the American’s can. Unfortunately you are incorrect. The American’s can only vote to weather they should defend themselves or not. This war was not waged by the US. This war was waged and declared by Al Qaeda, Hizbolla, Hamas, Ayatollah Khomeni and a bunch of other idiot’s who couldn’t give a rats ass what people vote in the US, the Netherlands or here in Denmark.

You can talk long and hard about the historical reasons for them doing this, but this is highly irrelevant today. You will probably also find that England and Turkey are way more responsible than the US as the seeds that started this whole idiocy goes back to the dissolvement of the Ottoman empire. As I said who cares, the current war was declared not by Europe and not by the US.

Whether Bush government is doing a good job or not at fighting the war is debatable, but that doesn’t stop the fact that you can’t vote yourself out of this war.

There is in reality very little we (Europeans and Americans) can do to stop this war, except defend ourselves. The war is not just against the US. It is also against Europe, it’s against normal every day Arab’s who want to live their normal modern lives in Lebanon, Iraq and Egypt.

Unfortunately the people who did start this war are not interested in or even capable of understanding of our way of living. Just look at the cartoon uproar we had to suffer in Denmark or the slaying of Theo Van Gogh in your own country. We like to look at ourself as open minded, unfortunately the otherside doesn’t give a shit.

As I said before I don’t like Bush. In particular I hate his attacks on civil rights and I don’t think that any of those attacks will help out in the war. However one thing us European’s need to realise is that while it’s easy to talk about the US civil rights issues, most of Europe has similar laws passing with zero debate.

Many European countries have never had the protection that the US constitution is meant to guarantee. See for example in my blog my analysis of the fucked up Danish constitution. Most of Europe already has identity cards and poor protection on free speech, property etc.

As we saw last night the US voted for a change. Not that I think it will help, Clinton started most of the attacks on civil rights that Bush managed to finish off.

And yes Ralph it is all about the innocent dying. Unfortunately we Western European’s have had our intellectually superior blinders on for so long that is near impossible for us to see what is going on. Their is an enemy and it is not who you think it is.

The only European countries who seem to have any clue are the former communist countries. Why? Well they remember that totalitarianism is NOT cool. When totalitarian governments come (be it Communist, Fascist, Catholic or Islamic) people die in great numbers.

Unfortunately for the Western European’s who have never had to fight for anything in their life are desperately looking for rebellion and happily put up posters of Arafat, Che and Lenin on their wall and claim moral superiority on the US who took over after the UK and before then France as being the universal evil for intellectuals everywhere.

Why don’t you join in the debate.